Grizzly bear attacks man picking berries in northern B.C.

[Tuc]

Bob, if I say this please do not take it as a personal attack. I am curious though about your pic.

I maybe stepping into dangerous waters here but here goes...Where did you get your avatar and what does it represent. Sorry I don't keep up with the new generation gaps nor do I intend to. I just can't relate your avatar picture to the outdoors but seeing it for the first time, ones mind does wonder.
Thx!

[BBJ]

I dont know I know when we were out in Cadomin I carryed my .280 just in case of bears , aswell as I had my bear spray . Fishing deep in the mountains and coming across a bear is a pretty good chance , but not a chance I wanna have to deal with . If it came to It , id shoot the damn thing and would report it being the right thing to do . My life is no less important then the next guy , But some man hungry , mischievous bear wants to come find out what I am because im a big ole piece of Juicy meat doesnt mean hes not gonna eat lead at least once . Gun over my shoulders , Easy to reach Loaded with 4 in the magazine and one chambered with the safety on .

Id sooner be judged by 8 strangers then carryed in a pine box by 8 of my best buddys .

[Boberama]

Bob, if I say this please do not take it as a personal attack. I am curious though about your pic.

I maybe stepping into dangerous waters here but here goes...Where did you get your avatar and what does it represent. Sorry I don't keep up with the new generation gaps nor do I intend to. I just can't relate your avatar picture to the outdoors but seeing it for the first time, ones mind does wonder.
Thx!

My avatar shows Lady Gaga from her Born This Way album. It also has a tribute to Ronnie James Dio in the signature picture.
I don't see what that has to do with the topic, though.


I have started a discussion about the responses of some here on another forum:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4650159

So you can see where I'm coming from in this debate.

[AxeMan]

I dont know I know when we were out in Cadomin I carryed my .280 just in case of bears , aswell as I had my bear spray . Fishing deep in the mountains and coming across a bear is a pretty good chance , but not a chance I wanna have to deal with . If it came to It , id shoot the damn thing and would report it being the right thing to do . My life is no less important then the next guy , But some man hungry , mischievous bear wants to come find out what I am because im a big ole piece of Juicy meat doesnt mean hes not gonna eat lead at least once . Gun over my shoulders , Easy to reach Loaded with 4 in the magazine and one chambered with the safety on .

Id sooner be judged by 8 strangers then carryed in a pine box by 8 of my best buddys .

You carry the gun over your shoulders with one in the spout with the safety on?  I personally would never do that because I don't trust the safety to that extent.  It can be bumped off in the shoulder carrying position or if you fall.  If your paranoid to the extent of carrying a rifle while fishing just leave the chamber empty at least.  It only takes a half second to cycle the action.  Hopefully you will never have to.

[Boberama]

It's not paranoia!

[walleyes]

Bob, if I say this please do not take it as a personal attack. I am curious though about your pic.

I maybe stepping into dangerous waters here but here goes...Where did you get your avatar and what does it represent. Sorry I don't keep up with the new generation gaps nor do I intend to. I just can't relate your avatar picture to the outdoors but seeing it for the first time, ones mind does wonder.
Thx!

My avatar shows Lady Gaga from her Born This Way album. It also has a tribute to Ronnie James Dio in the signature picture.
I don't see what that has to do with the topic, though.


I have started a discussion about the responses of some here on another forum:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4650159

So you can see where I'm coming from in this debate.

Do you even read other peoples post's or do you just read into them what you want ??
 
Again where in anybodies post did they ask for restrictions on the type of guns we should be able to own ??

[Boberama]

Bob, if I say this please do not take it as a personal attack. I am curious though about your pic.

I maybe stepping into dangerous waters here but here goes...Where did you get your avatar and what does it represent. Sorry I don't keep up with the new generation gaps nor do I intend to. I just can't relate your avatar picture to the outdoors but seeing it for the first time, ones mind does wonder.
Thx!

My avatar shows Lady Gaga from her Born This Way album. It also has a tribute to Ronnie James Dio in the signature picture.
I don't see what that has to do with the topic, though.


I have started a discussion about the responses of some here on another forum:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4650159

So you can see where I'm coming from in this debate.

Do you even read other peoples post's or do you just read into them what you want ??
 
Again where in anybodies post did they ask for restrictions on the type of guns we should be able to own ??

All I know is that members here have said it's scary people want to own a handgun, and that we shouldn't introduce nation-wide, shall-issue CCW permits.

I find this annoying in the extreme but I want to keep the conversation objective and above all civil.

[Paul]

If some guy decides to shoot an innocent man, then he deserves to be shot himself.

Sounds a lot like the old cowboy movies where there is 8 guys against one with a revolver. one smartass says "you only have 6 bullets" and the guy says "yeah but who's going to die?"

Do you want to be that innocent guy?

I call BS on that. I also call BS on the statement that it will increase the crime rate.

Look at the stats, gun deaths in the US are triple that in Canada. Don't even talk about countries like Brazil...

Do you have a problem with someone shooting a home invader?

None whatsover, and I mentioned it in an ealier post, I have no issues with a man protecting his family and property.

My life is no less important then the next guy , But some man hungry , mischievous bear wants to come find out what I am because im a big ole piece of Juicy meat doesnt mean hes not gonna eat lead at least once .

BBJ, a large, walking and talking steak....

I have absolutely no issues with people owning any type of firearm they want. Do I think I should be able to take a pistol into bear country? Damn right. But if me being able to pack a handgun around wherever I want leads to some piece of human shit shooting someone for their running shoes then I don't need to.

Defender shotgun, try one.

[Boberama]

I'm always contemplating moving to Oregon but the need to carry my 1911 has never been great enough.

I have absolutely no issues with people owning any type of firearm they want. Do I think I should be able to take a pistol into bear country? Damn right. But if me being able to pack a handgun around wherever I want leads to some piece of human shit shooting someone for their running shoes then I don't need to.

Pieces of human shit already carry guns. Laws don't stop 'em.

Criminals who are willing to shoot people don't care about gun laws.

And the gun violence rate in the US is not due to carry laws.

It's due to socio-economic factors such as a greater rate of poverty, a slightly different (more violent) culture, etc.

Defender shotgun, try one.

That doesn't make sense. Your saying people carrying pistols around = bad, but people carrying Defenders around = good?


Anyways I hate Defenders. How much weight does a stock add? Not much. How much more control does it give? A heck of a lot. I will never buy a Defender.

The Defender is the classic "gangbanger" style weapon, and you aren't against them, but you are against handguns?

[Paul]

Bob you are putting words in my mouth. I never said I am against handguns anywhere, in fact the only thing that actually offends and scares me is lady gaga's vagina...

[Dewey]

In my actual, hands-on field experience with both Grizzlies and Black Bears, I have found a "Defender" style shotgun to be about the least effective type of defence tool available. I have witnessed about a dozen Grizzly kills and several dozen Black Bear kills and done some extensive testing of various guns/loads as I carried a "bear gun" as a working tool for many years.

If, you CAN carry a long gun, that is the best option. I have had several custom-built Grizzly stoppers and have recently sold all but one of these. My last and what will stay with me is a custom P-64 Mod. 70 with a Classic sts. bbl., cut to 20", Recknagel fiber-optic irons, Leupy QRW mounts, Leupy 2.5CMHD scope and McMillan MC-style stock. The metal is Gun-Koted and this little gem shoots into .6-.7" at 100M consistently. It is a .375H&H and I load 300NPs over 76.5-H-4350 in WW cases with CCI-250s; the mv is 2400 fps. and that WILL do the job.

HOWEVER, when you are in your tent at night and/or have your hands full of tools of whatever wilderness work you are engaged in and are alone in remote bear country, as I have been many times and for months without a break, an appropriate handgun is a useful tool and one that should be available to ANY Canadian, who wishes to carry it, without a lot of government bullshit.

[Paul]

HOWEVER, when you are in your tent at night and/or have your hands full of tools of whatever wilderness work you are engaged in and are alone in remote bear country, as I have been many times and for months without a break, an appropriate handgun is a useful tool and one that should be available to ANY Canadian, who wishes to carry it, without a lot of government bullshit.

I fully agree Dewey. I think I should be allowed to carry whatever I want while in the bush, I am not in any way opposed to this. In fact I think 99.9% of the outdoor guys are responsible enough to manage this on their own. So what should be lobbied for is handgun owners right to carry a handgun while out in the bush if they so choose. Training, safe transport and safe storage are the keys.

[Tuc]

My avatar shows Lady Gaga from her Born This Way album. It also has a tribute to Ronnie James Dio in the signature picture.
I don't see what that has to do with the topic, though.

It has nothing at all to do with this topic. Thx for the explanation and I don't know about her vagina but Lady goga herself is pretty damn scary.

Did anyone hear how the feller that got attacked is doing?

[Boberama]

Bob you are putting words in my mouth. I never said I am against handguns anywhere, in fact the only thing that actually offends and scares me is lady gaga's vagina...

Very mature, I'm charmed.

[Tuc]

Very mature

So is that avatar!

[Boberama]

Very mature

So is that avatar!

Ignore the debate and attack the debater himself. Effective tactic, I suppose.

[walleyes]

Very mature

So is that avatar!

Ignore the debate and attack the debater himself. Effective tactic, I suppose.

After reading a few of your latest posts on a few different subjects I have to reiterate on my comment.. YOU are EXACTLY the type of person I am afraid owning a handgun.. In fact you are the persona used as an example of who shouldn't own any gun..

You need help mister,,, big time..

[Dewey]

My avatar shows Lady Gaga from her Born This Way album. It also has a tribute to Ronnie James Dio in the signature picture.
I don't see what that has to do with the topic, though.

It has nothing at all to do with this topic. Thx for the explanation and I don't know about her vagina but Lady goga herself is pretty damn scary.

Did anyone hear how the feller that got attacked is doing?

He was doing as well as can be expected when I last checked the Global-BC news and, barring a major infection, he should survive and will, hopefully, be back picking berries next year. A buddy of my best friend, a very experienced bushman and pro. guide in the Yukon, was mauled a couple of years ago; he was packing his .340 Weatherby and the bear still got him.....he now insists on carrying a heavy revolver and I tend to agree, having spent many years where I would be alone in bear country for extended periods and with no chance of rescue if I were attacked and injured.

Certainly, here in BC and in the "Territories" we should have our right to carry handguns protected by the Dominion Government and I had hoped that Harper would do this, but, he is just a lackey of the international corporate elite and has no concern for Canadian's rights or safety.

[Boberama]

Very mature

So is that avatar!

Ignore the debate and attack the debater himself. Effective tactic, I suppose.

After reading a few of your latest posts on a few different subjects I have to reiterate on my comment.. YOU are EXACTLY the type of person I am afraid owning a handgun.. In fact you are the persona used as an example of who shouldn't own any gun..

You need help mister,,, big time..

Why, thank you. I love you too. 

[sheepguide]

This is a pretty interesting discusion. While I agree we should have the rights to many things and hate to be told I cant do something but I have to agree that I have zero desire to see a bunch of hand guns being carried. Even if its the most level headed, experienced guys there are out there. The more honest legal guns wandering the streets the more that can possibly end up in the wrong hands. There is no need to carry a hand gun. There are legal means now that work fine for personl protection from wildlife. The only protection most use a hand gun against is other people.

Ive been around bears since I could walk and my family has been guiding in grizzly country since the early 60's in BC, Alberta, Yukon and the NWT and all they have ever carried or needed was a long gun.
Ive guided with guys in BC that have had permits to carry hand guns and they always argue how much better they are. I dont disagree that they wont work but they are far from better. Ive been full on charged by 3 grizzly bears. Two I shot and killed and one shot and turned but didnt kill. And many many warning shots fired.
The biggest and most aggressive was shot while on a moose kill. It came out of the bush while myself, my hunter and 2 hunters were retreiving meat and horns the morning after the moose was shot. We knew a bear had been on it so we were on full alert. That bear came out of the bush 150 yards away at full run making the most hair raisning grow you could imagine. There was zero doubt on his intentions and I dumped him with one shot head on with a 30-06 at 100 yards. Sure glad I wasnt packing a pistol on that occasion.

Ive been in the discusion with many guys in many hunting camps and its all the same . Each person has his or her personal preference. They all will work. Some like the pistol because it is fast and multiple rounds can be shot rapidly. The down fall is that most are only good close in. A long gun in "my opinion" is best as its good from long range down to a couple feet.
Others have very valid points on shotguns and would be my second choice. They load them in alternation with slugs and buckshot. And this also works.

Big thing is that most people that get mauled have zero chance to use any type of defense. One of my best friends was mauled in the Yukon. He had guided in that area for 15years and new all the bear defense and knew everything about being in bear country. Him and his hunter unknowingly walk between a sow grizz and a cub in bear high alders. He was packing a shot gun and the hunter a .300. When that bear stood up and charged he said everything he ever learned went out the window. He said it wouldnt have mattered if he had a hand gun shotgun, rifle or anything else. The distance was enough to get maybe one shot off but with panic in your brain things dont always function right . The hunter finally shot the bear but the damage was done already.

What im saying is all three will work fine. But I sure wouldnt say one is far supirior to the others. The main thing is if the user can stay calm enough to use them. Guys can talk big but when push comes to shove very very few of us will keep our composer in that situation. In 2007 I had my closest encounter and I shot that bear at full charge in camp at night. The distance was 5 paces from where I shot to where the bear fell. Did I stay calm and react right ? Shit no. I dont even remember the gun going off all I remember is turning to run. Situation wouldnt have been any different if I would have been carrying a pistol, shot gun or something bigger than the 30-30 I had at my hip.

Should handguns be more redily allowed out in the field? I dont beleive so. There are means to protect yourself so use what is there. But again just my opinion.


Oh and as for your ATV comment Dewey, if you think its only lazy guys that ride them you best rethink your statments!!!!!!!!

SG