Jason Kenney Charging For Backcountry Use

[AxeMan]

And meanwhile the Alberta government is again catering to the Natives and the Native crossbreeds.
http://www.albertametis.com/harvesting

The white man gets to pay more tax whether it is in the Bighorn/Castle or just to potentially go camp out somewhere in the bush now.  $30 more bucks please.
See where I am going with this?

For those that are okay with this, I have one more question for you:
Where does it end?

For me, this is way bigger than another lousy $30 bucks.  I can see our stupid Native worshipping governments give all of the land stewardship over to them and herd the stupid non-natives into their little designated parks with the "rule lists" and the "fees".  Sorry guys, cave in on shit like like this and all of our freedoms will soon slip away.

[greylynx]

Bad things are already happening in the bush with property assigned to our native and kinda-native brethren.

If whitey wants to fish Ruby Lake south of Hinton, whitey is supposed to ask entry permission from the Alexis reserve brethren at Lac St. Anne. The Alexis have a great big block of land given to them in that area.

If whitey wants to use the trail into A La Peche Lake north of Hinton, technically you have to get permission from the kind-native brethren people living north of the highway-side telephone at Grey.

I keep thinking when our native brethren are going to start charging access fees into these areas.

Access to some fishing areas in B.C. already has draconian no whiteys allowed areas. Trout Alley on Babine Lake is absolutely discraseful where the north side of the bank is a no whitey zone.

 

[guido]

Canadians should not be charged for entering a national park. Our taxes have paid for those parks already. Any non- Canadians should be charged.
A small fee for back country camping and trail usage is not wrong. We have been our worst enemy. Leaving messes and trail damage. Therefore we should pay. For every back country camp group, a license # should be recorded and that should be the person responsible for clean up of the area. If not cleaned up, fined.

[AxeMan]

Canadians should not be charged for entering a national park. Our taxes have paid for those parks already. Any non- Canadians should be charged.
A small fee for back country camping and trail usage is not wrong. We have been our worst enemy. Leaving messes and trail damage. Therefore we should pay. For every back country camp group, a license # should be recorded and that should be the person responsible for clean up of the area. If not cleaned up, fined.

Could it be that "WE" are not all lumped together in a group that willfully damages the landscape and leaves the mess?
Could it not be plausible that our existing high taxes cover the enforcement part of this matter and that the enforcement has some teeth to it covering the cleanup costs when actual offenders are found doing it?
Would adding another fee that would have to administered and enforced be just another unenforceable burden put on the already ineffective enforcement process and load?

Think about this scenario:  A group of responsible campers sets up a nice respectful camp back in the bush on a little clearing on a cutline along a creek. Warden Schmitt sees some tracks in there drops by on Friday evening and records their $30 sticker and license plate info.  They pull out Saturday late afternoon and the site is clean.  That evening a bunch of hooligans pull in and have booze party, cut down a bunch of live trees, do some donuts with their quads tearing up the area, camp for the night and pull out in the morning leaving a pile of garbage and broken bottles behind.  Busy warden Schmitt rolls back through there on Sunday afternoon and finds the mess.  What does he do, call up and fine the group with the $30 sticker?  See what I mean, unenforceable.

[guido]

Could it be that "WE" are not all lumped together in a group that willfully damages the landscape and leaves the mess?
Could it not be plausible that our existing high taxes cover the enforcement part of this matter and that the enforcement has some teeth to it covering the cleanup costs when actual offenders are found doing it?
Would adding another fee that would have to administered and enforced be just another unenforceable burden put on the already ineffective enforcement process and load?

Think about this scenario:  A group of responsible campers sets up a nice respectful camp back in the bush on a little clearing on a cutline along a creek. Warden Schmitt sees some tracks in there drops by on Friday evening and records their $30 sticker and license plate info.  They pull out Saturday late afternoon and the site is clean.  That evening a bunch of hooligans pull in and have booze party, cut down a bunch of live trees, do some donuts with their quads tearing up the area, camp for the night and pull out in the morning leaving a pile of garbage and broken bottles behind.  Busy warden Schmitt rolls back through there on Sunday afternoon and finds the mess.  What does he do, call up and fine the group with the $30 sticker?  See what I mean, unenforceable.

Simple solution. Everyone has a cell phone. Take a pic of the area when you leave. Date is on the pic. Can’t catch every speeder on the road.

[AxeMan]

Better answer for me would just say no to added taxes, thanks.
I'd have to say I pay enough with the 40% plus that I am taxed already.
That already covers enforcement of our existing laws.

[guido]

Better answer for me would just say no to added taxes, thanks.
I'd have to say I pay enough with the 40% plus that I am taxed already.
That already covers enforcement of our existing laws.

Jason Kenney to charge for access, OR Nutley and Flips making everything into a park. That's your painful choices.

[LeverAction]

I can guarantee you I’m not the one that did any of thoses things to the back country. So why should I pay a fee to be lumped in with thoses not-heads. My tax money pays for enforcement, make them pay.

[Walleyes]

I would bet it doesn’t get put in. I think Kenny will be more responsive to the people and if enough people are against it, it doesn’t go through. If enough people don’t go against and the majority support it, then the people have spoken and it gets passed. I would be game for that, simple majority wins.  Believe me if asked I would object to it as well, but if it does go through, it won’t wreck my day, it’s just life boys. Sask or Manitoba are looking better every day is all I can say.

[sonny]

Sounds to me like if the UCP gets in it might cost you $30/year to use the back country.

If the NDP gets in you might not be able to use the back country.

I think I'll choose the $30 route. Besides seniors get in free right? Just like the fishing licences?

[guido]

Sounds to me like if the UCP gets in it might cost you $30/year to use the back country.

If the NDP gets in you might not be able to use the back country.

I think I'll choose the $30 route. Besides seniors get in free right? Just like the fishing licences?

Yup, I think I can afford $2.50/ month.

[OL_JR]

Yup, I think I can afford $2.50/ month.

     LOL ya, I can afford 8 cents a day as well but that isn't the point.  If the government thinks there is a problem to be solved there is a heck of a pool to pull from if they make the effort and decide it is a priority. 

     I've said it before and I'll say it again, the biggest problem for the next generation is going to be tax burden/cost of living at this rate, we need the governments to start taking less not more. 

[AxeMan]

     LOL ya, I can afford 80 cents a day as well but that isn't the point.  If the government thinks there is a problem to be solved there is a heck of a pool to pull from if they make the effort and decide it is a priority. 

     I've said it before and I'll say it again, the biggest problem for the next generation is going to be tax burden/cost of living at this rate, we need the governments to start taking less not more.

Exactly, thank you.

The part of this that just pisses me off to no end is now the government is into the last freedoms we have.  Hell, one of the reasons I like going out into the bush is the feeling of freedom and escape from the bloody rat race of society.  That includes the fees and taxes and never ending signs and rules.  Now the sons of bitches want to bloody tax and police me in my refuge from society where I am costing nobody anything.  Now when I go to get away from it all, the pricks are still after me for a bit more.

It is not the point whether I can afford it not.  Certainly I can, but no way.  Different if this is some maintained trails or maintained campsite, but in the bush say in my hunting camp, no bloody way.  Some people have no bloody principles anymore and are easily herded around like bloody dumb sheep.  They can pay they damned $2.50 a month.  Government loves these kind of people and gets away with what they do because of them.

What is even worse though is the NDP's plan to take it all away and make it all one big controlled park.  Maybe in a few years, we whitey's will have to pay a government sanctioned Native guide to take us out and catch a fish on this park land. After all, they are the keepers of the land in the government's eye.  Give away our freedoms boys, and this is where we are headed.

Put it this way, if Notley's gang comes to my door during this campaign, they will be rudely booted off my property.  If Kenney's gang comes knocking, they are getting a lecture and a warning to smarten the hell up.

[LeverAction]

HERE, HERE, Axe and OL, It's about freedom of the land, freedom of to much Government, and freedom of Socialist and Liberal's telling me what I can do and not do with every step I take. I am a UPC supporter, but I will also make it very clear to them that I will not pay to access crown land. Hell they do that enough with national parks and provincial camp grounds, both of which I will never step foot in again and pay 1 red cent to.

[guido]

HERE, HERE, Axe and OL, It's about freedom of the land, freedom of to much Government, and freedom of Socialist and Liberal's telling me what I can do and not do with every step I take. I am a UPC supporter, but I will also make it very clear to them that I will not pay to access crown land. Hell they do that enough with national parks and provincial camp grounds, both of which I will never step foot in again and pay 1 red cent to.

I totally agree with you. But, as it stands, at the moment, its parks or 8 cents a day. Hopefully, there is enough intelligence in Alberta that we will have the ability to rescind the 8 cents if that's what people want.

[greylynx]

Remember, there are people who figure if they have to pay the government 30 bucks, let the government clean my mess of used diapers, paper plates, food wrappers, and dumped out septic trailer tanks.

These same people have the same attitude of dumping for free without ever having to pay 30 bucks. When is this damn nickel and diming going to end?

[JIMMY 808]

Word is feds want to shut down ski hills in Banff.

People form Alberta are not traveling to BC as much anymore just another screw. 

[OL_JR]

I totally agree with you. But, as it stands, at the moment, its parks or 8 cents a day. Hopefully, there is enough intelligence in Alberta that we will have the ability to rescind the 8 cents if that's what people want.

             I see what your saying and trust me I'd cut off my hand before stroking a ballot for the ndp but I don't support a fund for something that government should find the time for before reaching into my pockets.  I think any level headed person could see that there should be more money set aside for our public lands.  Fisheries, Wildlife and their habitat should be a priority.  Hopefully the new governments ear has a bit of bend to it.