Author Topic: CWD in Moose?  (Read 3072 times)

AxeMan

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CWD in Moose?
« on: February 19, 2013, 05:18:19 PM »
I have heard rumours that CWD has been found in moose.  I think a road killed moose down south turned up positive in a test.  Anyone else heard anything about this?

I am scared more by the reaction of what SRD might do than the actual disease itself.  Look at what they did to the moose in 353 in a lame ass move to protect a few caribou from wolves no less.  That one left me scratching my head.
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Tuc

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2013, 05:47:31 PM »
CWD can be found in moose but is more common in deer.

walleyes

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2013, 06:43:25 PM »
It's a scary thought,, not the fact an animal has the disease,, but to think what our idiot governments reaction will be. I am sure these diseases are nothing new in animals,, the only thing that has changed is that we are now testing them..

AxeMan

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2013, 07:17:49 PM »
I think I see a rip in the social fabric, Brother can you spare some ammo?
Gettin' down on the mountain, gettin' down on the mountain

Weste

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2013, 04:19:06 PM »
Found this on it from SRD so maybe we will be alright......whew.

http://srd.alberta.ca/FishWildlife/WildlifeDiseases/ChronicWastingDisease/CWDUpdates/documents/CWDinMooseAlberta-InfoSheet-Feb2013.pdf

Good to see they plan to stay status quo on the harvest.  Although I wouldnt be surprised if they increased the harvest rates in areas where moose live with infected deer.

deerman

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2013, 09:09:25 AM »
I have heard rumours that CWD has been found in moose.  I think a road killed moose down south turned up positive in a test.  Anyone else heard anything about this?

I am scared more by the reaction of what SRD might do than the actual disease itself.  Look at what they did to the moose in 353 in a lame ass move to protect a few caribou from wolves no less.  That one left me scratching my head.

I believe there is a logical explanation for that action.  Scratching your head will probably not reveal it.

Lets say you like a snack with your beer while watching the hockey game. (wolf pack needs meat every few days)
In your kitchen there are 100 cupboards and you can only open one a day.
Ten cupboards have pretzels (caribou) and 70 have chips (moose).

You will not go hungry often as there is a good chance there will be something in a cupboard you go to. ( a pack of wolves hunting will usually find a moose and once in awhile a caribou)

If 40 bags of chips are removed from the cupboards then there will be way more empty ones and you will miss out on your snack way more often.
(if the moose in an area are removed the wolf pack will not make a kill so regularly and some of the pack will die.

You cannot just switch from chips to pretzels it just depends on what you happen to find (or not find) in a cupboard.  (the wolves cannot just switch to eating caribou, it just depends on what they may find (or not find)in a day hunting)

walleyes

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2013, 01:01:27 PM »
I believe there is a logical explanation for that action.  Scratching your head will probably not reveal it.

Lets say you like a snack with your beer while watching the hockey game. (wolf pack needs meat every few days)
In your kitchen there are 100 cupboards and you can only open one a day.
Ten cupboards have pretzels (caribou) and 70 have chips (moose).

You will not go hungry often as there is a good chance there will be something in a cupboard you go to. ( a pack of wolves hunting will usually find a moose and once in awhile a caribou)

If 40 bags of chips are removed from the cupboards then there will be way more empty ones and you will miss out on your snack way more often.
(if the moose in an area are removed the wolf pack will not make a kill so regularly and some of the pack will die.

You cannot just switch from chips to pretzels it just depends on what you happen to find (or not find) in a cupboard.  (the wolves cannot just switch to eating caribou, it just depends on what they may find (or not find)in a day hunting)

????

walleyes

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2013, 08:12:25 PM »
Walleyes deerman has been drinking a little to much today at the confrence.  I agree with you. Deer what the hell is your post about?

Lol..

AxeMan

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2013, 09:06:17 PM »
Okay deerman, I'll try to play along here, even against my better judgement.

I open a cupboard and it is empty; damn I am getting hungry now.  The hockey game is in the third period (Oilers losing...lol) and my beer is almost empty.
I am going to get desparate and open another cupboard.  It may be empty too but the chance of it being pretzels are now doubled for that evening.  I am going to get more of those cupboards open in the next several games now and those pretzels are going to get eaten even faster.

That is the flaw I see in SRD's plan of trying to starve the wolves out by sacrificing the moose to save the caribou.  Wolves are resilient and will hunt hungry for a long time.  Hungry wolves are not going to be good for the caribou no matter how you slice it.
I think I see a rip in the social fabric, Brother can you spare some ammo?
Gettin' down on the mountain, gettin' down on the mountain

deerman

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2013, 05:32:07 PM »
Sorry you guys could not comprehend my analogy.  Glad it gave you some entertainment.

Some of you don't trust SRD and some of you are scraching your heads.  I guess we could just leave it at that.

deerman

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2013, 05:34:18 PM »

Speaking of CWD, there was a good presentation on CWD in deer in Alberta and what has happened and what the plaan for the future may be.

Sounds like more hunter harvest in the fall and some more consentrated harvest (hunter???) in the winter may be in order.

walleyes

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2013, 06:01:37 PM »
Sorry you guys could not comprehend my analogy.  Glad it gave you some entertainment.

Some of you don't trust SRD and some of you are scraching your heads.  I guess we could just leave it at that.

No,, we all got it deerman,, I'm just not sure we wanted to ??

deerman

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2013, 10:49:37 PM »
Maybe you missed the part where those states are dealing with white-tails and Alberta is dealing mostly with Mule deer.  Illinois is doing culls fall and winter and holding CWD at bay.  But then they are probably all lieing too maybe.???

During ther three years Alberta did culls the spread of CWD was declining.  In the three years they have Not been doing culls CWD has been expanding.  But of course Margo is lieing.

deerman

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #13 on: February 23, 2013, 07:42:21 AM »
Duffy.  Why did you change your name.  As soon as you started on cwd I knew who you were. Cwd is a joke and everybody is so wrong.  I have contacted personally more then one per state talking about this.  I don't know what Illinois is doing but you and your super star team at SRD can NOT dispute all the 40 years of data from Colorado that had it in both mule and wt's. They have not culled in many many years and have the second highest number of muledeer in north America. Also they have a great wt herd and the highest concentration of elk in northamerica. So I call bull shit on all this so called info you or Margo or any other is drawing in a coloring book. All your so called data is a sham. Also in Colorado and Wyoming Margo lied and said this was catastrophic to the herds there and it would be the same here. Well they did the same slaughter they are doing here and that is what cause it.  There herds are in great shape state wide in both states. Also in both of these states muledeer were the main carriers too so dot pull that it was wt's. Ishootbambi talked to Margo and busted here lieing more than once and then backpedaled very quick after he called her on it. So no I and everybody I know knows that SRD and Margo are over looking all the many years of data trying to be the first to stop cwd even though it is destroying our herd for nothing other than for her claim to try and be the first to stop cwd even though she knows all to well it will never be the case. 

Don't force that koolaid on others as most in Alberta are already aware of this crap.  Proove I am wrong Duffy.


It is quite obvious that you have made up your mind and you really don't want me to try and prove anything to you.  So I will not waste your time and myn.

AxeMan

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #14 on: February 23, 2013, 10:25:56 AM »
Deerman, I gave a reasonable rebuttal based on your analogy.  You chose to just blow it off?  I was hoping to debate it.  I was serious.  I don't think killing moose will protect caribou at all.  I don't trust SRD on this particular strategy.
If the wolf problem is so bad that the caribou are at that much risk from them, how about a local wolf bounty there?
I think I see a rip in the social fabric, Brother can you spare some ammo?
Gettin' down on the mountain, gettin' down on the mountain

deerman

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #15 on: February 23, 2013, 01:03:36 PM »
I did not mean to "blow it off"or offend anyone.

If I though people were really interested in "discussing" an issue with an open mind I would do so.  To me a "debate" means one chooses one side the other chooses the opposite side and they try to win a verbal war.  I am not interested in doing that.

It appeared to me you did not understand my analogy.

AxeMan

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2013, 01:14:50 PM »
Okay, forget it then. No worries. You are right, no debate on here about will prove a thing.  SRD will do what they want to do, regardless.
I think I see a rip in the social fabric, Brother can you spare some ammo?
Gettin' down on the mountain, gettin' down on the mountain

Alberta_huntress_83

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #17 on: February 23, 2013, 04:02:38 PM »
I personally think when man (SRD) intervenes and tries to "fix, manage, or control" wildlife going against the process of natural selection there is always a butterfly backlash effect for what we do. And its usually a pencil pushing collar who's never hunted making calls they have no business making. Increasing tags isn't going to rid the problem wholly. Its a bandaid for a broader issue we don't even fully understand.We should just watch and learn at this point because nature did just fine sustaining herself without us before. Mans track record with actually helping isn't the greatest. Mind you buffalo numbers are finally getting back up to huntable numbers we haven't had for generations thanks to hunting regulations but that's another issue.

Sorry I'm off topic from the analogy I just don't want to see more critters slaughtered than absolutely necessary.
There's no delight by day or night, than hunting in the morn. -   William Roscoe Thayer

deerman

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #18 on: February 23, 2013, 05:02:46 PM »
I personally think when man (SRD) intervenes and tries to "fix, manage, or control" wildlife going against the process of natural selection there is always a butterfly backlash effect for what we do. And its usually a pencil pushing collar who's never hunted making calls they have no business making. Increasing tags isn't going to rid the problem wholly. Its a bandaid for a broader issue we don't even fully understand.We should just watch and learn at this point because nature did just fine sustaining herself without us before. Mans track record with actually helping isn't the greatest. Mind you buffalo numbers are finally getting back up to huntable numbers we haven't had for generations thanks to hunting regulations but that's another issue.

Sorry I'm off topic from the analogy I just don't want to see more critters slaughtered than absolutely necessary.


I believe that "Man" has become much too involved for far to long to step back and let nature take it course.  Animals and recreation has become a big concern and an economic thing.

I think it is generally excepted that diseases spread more rapidly where population densities are high.  So it is reasonable to assume that lowering population densities should slow the spread of disease.  The unfortunate "slaughter" (cull) of deer in east Alberta was done to try and stop or slow the spread of CWD while a better solution was looked for.

From the information I saw yesterday it was working.  There was pressure to stop the "cull" and the spread of CWD increased in the next three years.  Fish & Wildlife would like to get back to a more active CWD management plan and the AF&GA supports and encourages that.

Alberta_huntress_83

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Re: CWD in Moose?
« Reply #19 on: February 24, 2013, 10:10:48 AM »

I believe that "Man" has become much too involved for far to long to step back and let nature take it course.  Animals and recreation has become a big concern and an economic thing.

I think it is generally excepted that diseases spread more rapidly where population densities are high.  So it is reasonable to assume that lowering population densities should slow the spread of disease.  The unfortunate "slaughter" (cull) of deer in east Alberta was done to try and stop or slow the spread of CWD while a better solution was looked for.

From the information I saw yesterday it was working.  There was pressure to stop the "cull" and the spread of CWD increased in the next three years.  Fish & Wildlife would like to get back to a more active CWD management plan and the AF&GA supports and encourages that.

So basically you're saying that SRD is too "invested" to back out now?!?! No. That's an unacceptable answer. And makes you sound stubborn and egotistical.

Furthermore, it is NOT reasonable to assume ANYTHING when it comes to nature and wildlife management.
Just because your stats look good on paper does not mean its been best for the herds. Are you even a hunter? Have you been to those units personally? Have you noticed before a super cold winter the fruits and berries and food supply naturally is in abundance to help animals prepare for colder longer months? Nature does take care of itself if we give it a chance
 Stop sounding so arrogant that you KNOW anything. You said so yourself its an assumption
 So listen to those who actually are truly invested and spend time in these units with these critters.
There's no delight by day or night, than hunting in the morn. -   William Roscoe Thayer